It’s a complicated issue with a lot of layers. Like a depressing onion.
Men were told to stop approaching women for any reason in any situation. So we did.
Dating apps and websites have overinflated women’s egos and absolutely obliterated most mens egos. The average looking guy with a job and some normal hobbies is going to get very few matches where as most women get hundreds a day regardless of their level of employment or having hobbies. This leads to women believing they can find the millionaire bachelor if they just hold out for longer when in reality they are not the women that the millionaire bachelor is going to pick.
Most women still expect men to be chivalrous and pay on the first date, but they have no actual intention of pursuing a relationship with that guy. Unfortunately some women have learned they can get a free meal and entertainment for an evening at no cost if they just say yes to dates they have no interest in. Most guys have been burned by that as some point.
A lot of women are still playing games. Saying no because they want the man to “chase” them or “fight” for them. Most guys have stopped entertaining that behavior whatsoever but I still see so many women doing it. As men we can’t tell if that’s what you want or if you actually mean it when you say no so the majority of us will immediately stop pursuing you if you decline us. I’m 33 and women are STILL doing this. I thought it would taper off as I got farther from high school aged girls but from my experience it has not gone down in any significant way.
There are a million other reasons and nuanced details but I am tired of typing.
Myself and most men I know around my age who all did very well in the dating scene when we were younger have just completely given up on dating now. We have zero interest in putting in the time, energy and money into something that yeilds nothing in return these days.
Like most things I think this will reach a breaking point and things will shift but I’m not sure when that will be or what will push things over the edge.
One of my friends straight up used a guy to help her move and ditched him immediately after. It’s honestly so fucked up what otherwise very nice women think is totally fine to do. She bragged about doing this and my other friends cheered her on for it. I couldn’t even imagine being the guy in that situation, just getting treated like an exploitable slave?
I definitely wouldn’t say they bring nothing to the table. It’s just that they expect you to bring a lot to the table and often times they bring little to the table. If they also didn’t expect you to bring much then it wouldn’t be so bad, but they expect it all while doing little to nothing in return.
If you don’t like women, then date men. You are telling us you can’t connect to women, then you aren’t attracted to them. If you were you would connect emotionally with them. You’re probably just straight because you were told to be for so long and you made it an identity. Open your mind and think about those male friends you had you made excuses to wrestle with a little bit more just so you could feel his touch. Just give in to what you know to be true.
If you were you would connect emotionally with them.
wanting that emotional connection doesn’t mean the BS can get too much to put up with, but the emotional connection seeking condition on gender can be absolute, even if a any gender can provide you with orgasms.
Splitting the bill on the first date is possible with the right women, but for a lot of women the second you mention it they get offended and/or ghost you. I would say ~30% are open to splitting the bill for the first date and the rest find it to be a huge turn off or they will legitimately get mad.
I have had women call me broke and tell me to delete their number when I suggest we split the first date bill before hand. I mean it weeds out the bad ones early but it still sucks.
Yeah but typically that conversation comes after days of texting/calling to get to know them somewhat. It’s not like I’m gonna match with someone and immediately ask them if they are comfortable splitting the bill on the first date. Maybe I should just ask that right out of the gate to avoid wasting time. Idk.
It’s the constant lost progress that wears you down. You’re carrying the conversation and keeping it fun while half the women are dry and give short answers to everything because they are messaging back the 20 other guys who all matched with them that day. So you put in the effort to try and stand out only to find out the night before a date or when a date is first brought up that they aren’t compatible. It’s just draining on you after enough times.
Honestly though, it’s a good way to weed out that 70% with antiquated conceptions is gender norms which will probably cause problems later in the relationship anyway. If they get that offended over splitting the check in a first date, they’re probably gonna hold you to unworkable heteronormative expectations later, too.
Before I met my wife I went on paid for the bunch of people. Good percent of them wanted to pay their share. You can also discuss it prior to actually going on the date and then you don’t get surprised. Just basic communication
I never said it was a new shitty behavior from women. It’s just that more men are aware of it now. Especially since a lot of women will post about it online and while they do get to share it with their yaaas queen slay fan base men do also see those posts. They see those comments where women are bragging about how many dates they have gone on with zero intention of actually romantically engaging with the man at any point.
And to be clear I am not sitting here thinking this is a one way street. I am fully aware that men have a long history of going on dates just to get laid and then never talking to that woman again.
Both genders got shit they need to work on just like most people got shit they need to work on.
I think you’re still just seeing the noisy few and those people are not the norm. The most vocal people are not necessarily the majority. I think most people on both sides or all sides are just looking for someone they’re compatible with
So either myself and all other other single men I talk to about this all have terrible luck or there is some sort of shift that’s happened in the last ~10 years and it’s finally getting so bad that others are picking up on it.
I was in a relationship or dating in one form or another from the age of like 14 until I was ~27. Only in the last 6-7 years did it get really bad.
I think it’s a combination of a lot of things but ultimately it’s become a numbers game and most guys just don’t want to put up with the bullshit anymore. Especially in this economy many dudes are just checking out. Not only from dating but basically everything.
You’re complaints sound like they were copy and pasted from an Andrew Tate manuscript. Most men I know who are healthy and well adjusted have a girlfriend or wife. I dont think ive dated a woman in the last 5 years who expected me to be chivalrous or wanted to “play games” with me and make me chase. My friends and I have been having amazing luck with dating recently I guess. 8 out of 9 of us are either married or in a long term relationship. And were not rich or extremely attractive lmfao. Maybe it’s because none of us are incels and don’t just wanna fuck the first thing with 2 legs to say yes. I feel like men like you can’t see anything a woman is past the vagina, like maybe if you tried to just be friendly instead of horny they would’ve opened up to you and trusted you. Instead most men act like women owe them something when they buy them a gift or a meal. My friends have paid for my food before and I didn’t get on the ground and suck them off, why should a girl be expected to do that.
Let me start by saying I’m not agreeing or disagreeing with the post you’re replying to.
8 out of 9 of us are either married or in a long term relationship.
How long? Because many of the points being made by the comments in this thread are talking about how things changed in the past few years. If you got together pre pandemic you wouldn’t have been dating in the environment many are talking about. Even if you got together in like 2021 you may not have experienced it at it’s worst (according to them).
Disclaimer: I am married and haven’t ever experienced the “dating scene” because I’m with my high school sweetheart. But you need to understand a lot of what the posts in this thread are talking about they’re claiming is very recent.
That said, this post (the image) is 100% incel propaganda, accidental if I’m being generous.
Secondly: Yikes bro. You made a LOT of assumptions and pretty much all of them were wrong.
I don’t really give a shit about sex. At least that’s not my goal when dating. I am looking for someone that is kind, thoughtful and curious. Someone who is intellectually stimulating and emotionally mature.
I could call up pretty much any of my exes and get sex if that’s all I was after. I am just looking for genuine human connection.
When my choices are expend time, energy and money just to be taken advantage of/toyed with or sit at home and be at peace with myself I’m gonna take the peace every time now.
If you went fishing for years and never caught anything except toxic sludge at some point you just stop fishing. Spend that time and energy on something else. That’s where most men are at these days. And yeah some of those guys are just unrealistic assholes, but most of them really aren’t.
Personally I am just living my life. If I happen to bump into someone and hit it off I won’t fight it, but I’m not going to actively spend my time, money and energy looking anymore.
This just icks me out. Do you believe men can’t be out off by what you said? (Not that I agree or disagree with what you said.) It just feels nasty to assume the dissent is from women specifically.
Like the other comment said you’re reading into it a bit much.
And I would feel fairly confident that the commenter was a woman because attacking someones personality (that they don’t know at all) is typically done by women. If they don’t like something you said they tend to tell you that you have a crap personality or a tiny dick.
So I am open to being wrong about that commenter, but I would feel comfortable putting a gentlemans bet of 1 dollar that it was left by a woman.
It’s a complicated issue with a lot of layers. Like a depressing onion.
Men were told to stop approaching women for any reason in any situation. So we did.
Dating apps and websites have overinflated women’s egos and absolutely obliterated most mens egos. The average looking guy with a job and some normal hobbies is going to get very few matches where as most women get hundreds a day regardless of their level of employment or having hobbies. This leads to women believing they can find the millionaire bachelor if they just hold out for longer when in reality they are not the women that the millionaire bachelor is going to pick.
Most women still expect men to be chivalrous and pay on the first date, but they have no actual intention of pursuing a relationship with that guy. Unfortunately some women have learned they can get a free meal and entertainment for an evening at no cost if they just say yes to dates they have no interest in. Most guys have been burned by that as some point.
A lot of women are still playing games. Saying no because they want the man to “chase” them or “fight” for them. Most guys have stopped entertaining that behavior whatsoever but I still see so many women doing it. As men we can’t tell if that’s what you want or if you actually mean it when you say no so the majority of us will immediately stop pursuing you if you decline us. I’m 33 and women are STILL doing this. I thought it would taper off as I got farther from high school aged girls but from my experience it has not gone down in any significant way.
There are a million other reasons and nuanced details but I am tired of typing.
Myself and most men I know around my age who all did very well in the dating scene when we were younger have just completely given up on dating now. We have zero interest in putting in the time, energy and money into something that yeilds nothing in return these days.
Like most things I think this will reach a breaking point and things will shift but I’m not sure when that will be or what will push things over the edge.
One of my friends straight up used a guy to help her move and ditched him immediately after. It’s honestly so fucked up what otherwise very nice women think is totally fine to do. She bragged about doing this and my other friends cheered her on for it. I couldn’t even imagine being the guy in that situation, just getting treated like an exploitable slave?
Same here. Most women bring nothing to the table, so there’s no rush. I’d rather save the money and spend my time studying or playing video games
I definitely wouldn’t say they bring nothing to the table. It’s just that they expect you to bring a lot to the table and often times they bring little to the table. If they also didn’t expect you to bring much then it wouldn’t be so bad, but they expect it all while doing little to nothing in return.
If you don’t like women, then date men. You are telling us you can’t connect to women, then you aren’t attracted to them. If you were you would connect emotionally with them. You’re probably just straight because you were told to be for so long and you made it an identity. Open your mind and think about those male friends you had you made excuses to wrestle with a little bit more just so you could feel his touch. Just give in to what you know to be true.
If he was gay he wouldn’t be in this conversation at all.
Weaponized homophobia is every female narcissists favorite tool against men.
This is stupid and you should feel bad.
Listen if I was gay I would date a man so quickly. Unfortunately I just do not find men sexually attractive. Trust me.
You’re being creepy.
wanting that emotional connection doesn’t mean the BS can get too much to put up with, but the emotional connection seeking condition on gender can be absolute, even if a any gender can provide you with orgasms.
I do like women and I do maintain platonic relationships with women
My aunt admitted she did the free meal thing back in the 70s. It’s not new. This whole thing is bs. People just have whiny echo chambers now.
I’m gay but I’ve only ever been on dates where both of us paid for our own meals. I think hetero dating is just broken and they should start over
Splitting the bill on the first date is possible with the right women, but for a lot of women the second you mention it they get offended and/or ghost you. I would say ~30% are open to splitting the bill for the first date and the rest find it to be a huge turn off or they will legitimately get mad.
I have had women call me broke and tell me to delete their number when I suggest we split the first date bill before hand. I mean it weeds out the bad ones early but it still sucks.
Okay, but if it’s that big of a deal to you, wouldn’t you be happy to know you’re incompatible with that person right away over such a simple topic?
Yeah but typically that conversation comes after days of texting/calling to get to know them somewhat. It’s not like I’m gonna match with someone and immediately ask them if they are comfortable splitting the bill on the first date. Maybe I should just ask that right out of the gate to avoid wasting time. Idk.
It’s the constant lost progress that wears you down. You’re carrying the conversation and keeping it fun while half the women are dry and give short answers to everything because they are messaging back the 20 other guys who all matched with them that day. So you put in the effort to try and stand out only to find out the night before a date or when a date is first brought up that they aren’t compatible. It’s just draining on you after enough times.
Honestly though, it’s a good way to weed out that 70% with antiquated conceptions is gender norms which will probably cause problems later in the relationship anyway. If they get that offended over splitting the check in a first date, they’re probably gonna hold you to unworkable heteronormative expectations later, too.
Before I met my wife I went on paid for the bunch of people. Good percent of them wanted to pay their share. You can also discuss it prior to actually going on the date and then you don’t get surprised. Just basic communication
I never said it was a new shitty behavior from women. It’s just that more men are aware of it now. Especially since a lot of women will post about it online and while they do get to share it with their yaaas queen slay fan base men do also see those posts. They see those comments where women are bragging about how many dates they have gone on with zero intention of actually romantically engaging with the man at any point.
And to be clear I am not sitting here thinking this is a one way street. I am fully aware that men have a long history of going on dates just to get laid and then never talking to that woman again.
Both genders got shit they need to work on just like most people got shit they need to work on.
I think you’re still just seeing the noisy few and those people are not the norm. The most vocal people are not necessarily the majority. I think most people on both sides or all sides are just looking for someone they’re compatible with
So either myself and all other other single men I talk to about this all have terrible luck or there is some sort of shift that’s happened in the last ~10 years and it’s finally getting so bad that others are picking up on it.
I was in a relationship or dating in one form or another from the age of like 14 until I was ~27. Only in the last 6-7 years did it get really bad.
I think it’s a combination of a lot of things but ultimately it’s become a numbers game and most guys just don’t want to put up with the bullshit anymore. Especially in this economy many dudes are just checking out. Not only from dating but basically everything.
Summary: hoe_math
Right?
His videos are hilarious. Mostly accurate too.
You’re complaints sound like they were copy and pasted from an Andrew Tate manuscript. Most men I know who are healthy and well adjusted have a girlfriend or wife. I dont think ive dated a woman in the last 5 years who expected me to be chivalrous or wanted to “play games” with me and make me chase. My friends and I have been having amazing luck with dating recently I guess. 8 out of 9 of us are either married or in a long term relationship. And were not rich or extremely attractive lmfao. Maybe it’s because none of us are incels and don’t just wanna fuck the first thing with 2 legs to say yes. I feel like men like you can’t see anything a woman is past the vagina, like maybe if you tried to just be friendly instead of horny they would’ve opened up to you and trusted you. Instead most men act like women owe them something when they buy them a gift or a meal. My friends have paid for my food before and I didn’t get on the ground and suck them off, why should a girl be expected to do that.
Let me start by saying I’m not agreeing or disagreeing with the post you’re replying to.
How long? Because many of the points being made by the comments in this thread are talking about how things changed in the past few years. If you got together pre pandemic you wouldn’t have been dating in the environment many are talking about. Even if you got together in like 2021 you may not have experienced it at it’s worst (according to them).
Disclaimer: I am married and haven’t ever experienced the “dating scene” because I’m with my high school sweetheart. But you need to understand a lot of what the posts in this thread are talking about they’re claiming is very recent.
That said, this post (the image) is 100% incel propaganda, accidental if I’m being generous.
First of all: *Your
Secondly: Yikes bro. You made a LOT of assumptions and pretty much all of them were wrong.
I don’t really give a shit about sex. At least that’s not my goal when dating. I am looking for someone that is kind, thoughtful and curious. Someone who is intellectually stimulating and emotionally mature.
I could call up pretty much any of my exes and get sex if that’s all I was after. I am just looking for genuine human connection.
When my choices are expend time, energy and money just to be taken advantage of/toyed with or sit at home and be at peace with myself I’m gonna take the peace every time now.
If you went fishing for years and never caught anything except toxic sludge at some point you just stop fishing. Spend that time and energy on something else. That’s where most men are at these days. And yeah some of those guys are just unrealistic assholes, but most of them really aren’t.
Personally I am just living my life. If I happen to bump into someone and hit it off I won’t fight it, but I’m not going to actively spend my time, money and energy looking anymore.
What stinks like shit? Oh it’s your personality.
Interesting response. I take it you must be one of those women I was referring to in part of my comment somewhere.
This just icks me out. Do you believe men can’t be out off by what you said? (Not that I agree or disagree with what you said.) It just feels nasty to assume the dissent is from women specifically.
Like the other comment said you’re reading into it a bit much.
And I would feel fairly confident that the commenter was a woman because attacking someones personality (that they don’t know at all) is typically done by women. If they don’t like something you said they tend to tell you that you have a crap personality or a tiny dick.
So I am open to being wrong about that commenter, but I would feel comfortable putting a gentlemans bet of 1 dollar that it was left by a woman.
He just implied they were one of the people being complained about, so they got mad and left a mean comment. you’re reading into it too much imo.
Says an asshat