Yeah. It’s hard to balance the need to know if i need to flee immediately with the massive amount of psychological damage from being aware of how dire the situation is. Like if I’m not well informed it could mean becoming stuck in a situation that is rapidly deteriorating. However if I am well informed then I just deal with constant panic attacks, worsening depressing, and spiraling mental health. I’m compromising by paying attention for a couple hours every few days and deliberately avoiding all news in the interim.

… you made the claim. It’s your prerogative to argue for it.

According to this statista article at least 80% of their population has mobile phones with internet access as of 2023. So I’m not sure exactly what you’re talking about here.

Well because 10 million people is more than enough to commit crimes against humanity on a frankly ungodly scale. You can commit genocide with those numbers.

I’m an anarchist, so ideally I’d advocate no government whatsoever in which case we could… shall we say do away with the nazis the way God intended. But we don’t, do we. We live in a society with prisons that currently house millions of people who shouldn’t be there. Nazis should be there, or dead. Either is fine but the least we could do is lock them up and prevent them from interacting with other humans.

Barrack Obama did nothing to prevent fascism. He was an American imperialist who was directly involved in the mass murder of innocent people in the middle east. I also just honestly love that you defended my strawman version of your arguments, genuinely incredible.

Saying that you’re not a progressive is as good as saying you don’t really care if Nazis take over again. You’re not invested in it enough to actually try and change anything.

You also ignored 90% of what I had to say about Hitler. I guess because you have no legitimate response to that? Do you believe that Hitler just came along to find a Germany that was already genocidally bigoted towards queer people and jews? If so you were given a seriously poor education. Germany was arguably the most liberal country in the world leading up to his rise to power. Your failure to understand that Trump played into the exact same political strategies that Hitler did belies your poor understanding of how Hitler came to be democratically elected. The world was not that dramatically different from today. People relied on mass media in much the same ways they do today, just at the time that was print and air waves. Radio stories and misinformation can be broadcast on the same day they happen though, much like social media stories can today. The media is and has always been inherently intertwined with fascism. It’s how you can indoctrinate someone into genocidal bigotry. Tell them everyone is lying to them and secretly jews control everything, and make it so that’s all they hear all the time from birth, and you have created a mass indoctrination machine and predisposed all those people towards genocidal violence.

Hitler was elected my guy. There’s no evidence that his electoral victory in 1933 was in any way tampered with. He was democratically elected. He ran on a campaign of ending democracy. Same deal as Trump pretty well. He also served prison time. He was punished by the law. That didn’t stop the people for voting for him to end democracy. He campaigned on genocidal authoritarian fascism. He bought media companies and proliferated fascist ideology over radio and newspaper. He had movies made to promote fascism. But he broke no laws doing any of that. He was elected.

You are essentially saying that the government of Weimar Germany did nothing wrong. They prosecuted him legally for crimes he committed during an insurrection attempt. Then when he was free he ran about talking about how great fascism is and how awful the jews are and how great it’d be if he got elected cause he’d take all the jews out of the government and the schools and the media. All of those were actual campaign points of his. People readily voted for it. They practically worshiped him before he was even elected.

Nazis don’t deserve fairness. Nazis should be met with a fist. They advocate the destruction of liberty and crimes against humanity. They indoctrinate others into genocidal bigotry. Tolerating their presence at all is unacceptable, and they should be forcefully removed from society by legal frameworks.

I also never said you were a conservative but that you were convinced by conservatism. Liberalism is also not a left-wing ideology. Individual rights is mostly a buzzword for unfettered and unrestricted capitalism. Elon Musk loves talking about individual rights and freedom of speech from his billionaire fascist pulpit where he silences anyone arguing against him lol.

Ironically this conversation always comes up in conversation about how “we really need to let Nazis speak you guys. No don’t silence them it’ll hurt democracy’s feelings :( yes they’re convincing everyone to kill the minorities but no no no we need to let them talk, yes i know they recruit regardless of whether we tell anyone their fascists because their entire ideology is based on non-falsifiable conspiracies about minorities secretly controlling the world but no it’s okee we just need to let them talk and everyone will reject them im sure” aaaaaaaaaaand fascists have taken over your country. The same way they did in the 30s. And the 20s. The same way they have time and again over and over and over, proving without any shadow of a doubt that history will endlessly repeat itself specifically because everyone seems hellbent on refusing to learn from it.

Yeah you’re a liberal. You’re not a leftist or a progressive. I’m an anarchist, ironically as you listed that there lol Nazis can get bent, and the government should’ve had them all sentenced to life in prison without outside contact. If, you know, the government actually cared at all about preventing a fascist uprising. Kinda too late now, there’s probably a good 10 million totally indoctrinated american fascists, at least.

If this is already true then how does making it illegal to be a Nazi change that? If Nazis will already get into power (and then restrict non-nazi or anti-nazi speech), then what exactly is the risk of making it illegal to espouse Nazi ideology?

Nazis will limit my speech if they get into power one way or the other, what are you talking about lol. If they get into power they will literally kill me, that’s their stated goal.

Okay, well, in FreeSpeechAbsolutismLand the nazis will now run around convincing everyone that being a Nazi is totally cool and you should do it too, fast forward and congratulations Hitler just got elected because the Nazis bought out the major media organizations and indoctrinated everyone into Nazism. Now, let’s review. Is there anywhere along the way that the government could have done something to prevent Nazis from taking over the country?

Like, come on, this is so ridiculous. You’ve been so convinced by conservatism that restricting the right to say literally anything immediately turns your country into Soviet Russia that you’re here protecting Nazis. It’s just foolish. You’re acting like it’s absolutely impossible to have any laws at all because inevitably they will be misinterpreted to their extreme. It’s like “should murder be illegal because what if people in power decide fetuses count as people and are therefore murder-able” like no we can actually restrict specific things. I don’t see many people advocating the legalization of murder so as to prevent abortion rights from being restricted by advocates of fetal personhood.

I mean I’m not advocating for that though. I don’t think it’s impossible to restrict specifically fascist rhetoric. I don’t think it’s impossible to make it illegal to advocate for genocide of racial and gender minorities.

We don’t have to, there’s no rule saying either we have Nazis or no one can say anything. I don’t agree that “saying nazi stuff” is nebulous enough that it could be construed to mean “saying not nazi stuff”.

I also don’t feel you adequately responded to my pointing out that protecting the rights of Nazis to be Nazis only benefits Nazis at the expense of literally everyone else and allowing Nazis to make political parties and manipulate society.

Your society has fundamentally failed to protect the rights of its citizens if Nazis can exist within it. They should face legal action for their views.

Fascist speech is not hard to point out. Advocating for the removal of the human rights of minority groups should result in legal punishment. Advocating for violence against minorities should result in legal punishment.

No one is born a Nazi. You should not be able to exist in society as a Nazi. You should face legal action for being a Nazi. We hung people at Nuremberg over this. We have already long since had established definitions of what inciting genocide is, of what spreading fascism is.

Okay, but are Jewish people supposed to just accept that you’re walking around calling for the mass murder of their communities?

Weimar Germany was a society that was governed on this principle of a “marketplace of ideas” where “unacceptable evil beliefs will naturally be rejected”, so is the modern united states. You can see two pretty clear examples of how this does not work and just allows fascists to promote their view points.

Say in you’re example you’re not just some guy on the street corner. Say you’re a media executive. Say you’re a politician. Say you’re a billionaire. Is it still permissible? Say you make a new political party called the “kill all the jews” party, and you make friends with all the major media executives to promote your views non-stop all day every day on the air. Is it still permissible? Say you buy out social media websites, and make it against the TOS for those websites to say anything denouncing of the “kill all the jews” party. Then you flood those websites with indoctrination material and fabricated news stories. Is it still permissible?

Hate speech can and should be faced with legal prosecution. You should face legal repercussions for calling for all Jewish people to be murdered. Freedom of speech should not protect violent bigotry. The goal of government should be to provide the greatest quality of life for all. That is incompatible with allowing people to spread violent hate speech and indotrinate others into violent bigotry. This mistake has been made time and again. Fascists are the ones who fight the absolute hardest for “freedom to say nazi shit”. Because of course they want it to be legal for them to do that, they’re nazis. Protecting them from legal consequences for being Nazis literally only benefits Nazis.

Misinformation and violent rhetoric about minorities is hate. It has no place in society and allowing it achieves nothing expect the proliferation of bigotry.