You’re probably aware but if not. It’s already a rallying cry. “Iran is threatening everyone including Israel, if we don’t defend them Iran will destroy Israel, your an antisemite of you don’t support stopping Iran first”
The inevitable conclusion to this shit is “ok, guess I’m an antisemite then”.
Do they think labels of bigotry will make people change their opinion? Do they know what fucking country they live in? That doesn’t even work when the labeling of bigots is true. Hell, they end up in the white house.
It’s kinda like saying “you’re being racist by supporting affirmative action.” It’s like alright rather be racist than have every workplace/university be 99% white because they can afford good schools/prep material…
Right now, for everyone except Israel and Iran, the war is about opening the Strait of Hormuz and stopping Iran from collecting a toll there. Letting Iran continue like they do now would set a terrible precedent for global trade.
Right, despite starting this was with the expressed intention of collapsing their society, we can’t have America not go back to the status quo of imposing sanctions on Iran while Iran spends money and resources every year for maritime upkeep so American trade can continue to pass through freely. We wouldn’t want terrible precedents set.
I’m at a bit of a loss as to where to start replying to this. Nowhere did I imply that I was in favor of Trump, or that I don’t consider this war to be an embarrassing and horrific mistake, or that I found the previous status quo to be ideal - and even if I did imply it, it is quite irrelevant as to whether or not what I posted was true.
…and it is true. The closure of the strait is a huge threat to global trade, and the rules and norms that keep it flowing - and thus it’s a threat to all of our economies.
The status quo that you claim to not find ideal and don’t think is relevant is what enabled the global trade you think is being threatened. The rules and norms imposed by the US by threat of force.
Oh no, the ship is charged $1 million to pass through the straight, how will global trade survive!?
I’ve seen estimates the fee would range from 1-5% of total ship cargo value on average. Hardly threatening global trade.
Repay them for all the war damages, remove all sanctions, give them their frozen assets back, and then ask them kindly to allow free passage through the straight again. But this whole we’re gonna bomb you, kill your religious leader, kill hundreds of your children, destroy your civilian infrastructure, and we want you to go back to the deal that gives us an advantage doesn’t work when they destroyed all your assets in the region, drained your munitions, and put on display your actual lack of power for all to see. Pay up, it’s you’re turn.
You misunderstood me. What I meant is that who I am, or what my opinions are on other matters, is quite irrelevant as to whether I’m right about this.
But for the record: I am not American, I’m European, I consider the war to be a tragic and embarrassing mistake, and I think the threats and whole attitude of the American administration reeks of naiveté and macho bullshit. It would be wonderful if the US would aid in rebuilding and cleaning up the mess they’ve made (and maybe just recognize for half a second the damage that can’t be repaired, like all the lives lost), but given past experiences I wouldn’t hold my breath.
However, while those rules may have been enforced by the US, they have been internationally agreed upon, and they benefited pretty much everyone else as well. In fact, as far as I’m aware, the goods flowing through the strait are mostly headed towards Asia. Americans are unlikely to be much directly affected by these tolls - but just like everyone else, they will be indirectly affected by friction being added to global trade.
I doubt Iran will find many friends here - especially since there are other straits as well, and countries that trade through them will likely want to set an example, so no one thinks to copy Iran’s attempts. Because of this, I’m pretty sure the sanctions (which are also internationally agreed upon) are unlikely to be lifted without free passage through the strait.
I’m waiting for the inevitable cry of “ending this war is antisemitism”.
You’re probably aware but if not. It’s already a rallying cry. “Iran is threatening everyone including Israel, if we don’t defend them Iran will destroy Israel, your an antisemite of you don’t support stopping Iran first”
The inevitable conclusion to this shit is “ok, guess I’m an antisemite then”.
Do they think labels of bigotry will make people change their opinion? Do they know what fucking country they live in? That doesn’t even work when the labeling of bigots is true. Hell, they end up in the white house.
It’s kinda like saying “you’re being racist by supporting affirmative action.” It’s like alright rather be racist than have every workplace/university be 99% white because they can afford good schools/prep material…
There’s absolutely no way that’s gonna backfire…
Right now, for everyone except Israel and Iran, the war is about opening the Strait of Hormuz and stopping Iran from collecting a toll there. Letting Iran continue like they do now would set a terrible precedent for global trade.
Right, despite starting this was with the expressed intention of collapsing their society, we can’t have America not go back to the status quo of imposing sanctions on Iran while Iran spends money and resources every year for maritime upkeep so American trade can continue to pass through freely. We wouldn’t want terrible precedents set.
I’m at a bit of a loss as to where to start replying to this. Nowhere did I imply that I was in favor of Trump, or that I don’t consider this war to be an embarrassing and horrific mistake, or that I found the previous status quo to be ideal - and even if I did imply it, it is quite irrelevant as to whether or not what I posted was true.
…and it is true. The closure of the strait is a huge threat to global trade, and the rules and norms that keep it flowing - and thus it’s a threat to all of our economies.
The status quo that you claim to not find ideal and don’t think is relevant is what enabled the global trade you think is being threatened. The rules and norms imposed by the US by threat of force.
Oh no, the ship is charged $1 million to pass through the straight, how will global trade survive!?
I’ve seen estimates the fee would range from 1-5% of total ship cargo value on average. Hardly threatening global trade.
Repay them for all the war damages, remove all sanctions, give them their frozen assets back, and then ask them kindly to allow free passage through the straight again. But this whole we’re gonna bomb you, kill your religious leader, kill hundreds of your children, destroy your civilian infrastructure, and we want you to go back to the deal that gives us an advantage doesn’t work when they destroyed all your assets in the region, drained your munitions, and put on display your actual lack of power for all to see. Pay up, it’s you’re turn.
You misunderstood me. What I meant is that who I am, or what my opinions are on other matters, is quite irrelevant as to whether I’m right about this.
But for the record: I am not American, I’m European, I consider the war to be a tragic and embarrassing mistake, and I think the threats and whole attitude of the American administration reeks of naiveté and macho bullshit. It would be wonderful if the US would aid in rebuilding and cleaning up the mess they’ve made (and maybe just recognize for half a second the damage that can’t be repaired, like all the lives lost), but given past experiences I wouldn’t hold my breath.
However, while those rules may have been enforced by the US, they have been internationally agreed upon, and they benefited pretty much everyone else as well. In fact, as far as I’m aware, the goods flowing through the strait are mostly headed towards Asia. Americans are unlikely to be much directly affected by these tolls - but just like everyone else, they will be indirectly affected by friction being added to global trade.
I doubt Iran will find many friends here - especially since there are other straits as well, and countries that trade through them will likely want to set an example, so no one thinks to copy Iran’s attempts. Because of this, I’m pretty sure the sanctions (which are also internationally agreed upon) are unlikely to be lifted without free passage through the strait.
So do you get paid for doing this sort shit for the trump regime? Or are you just a fucking moron?