I dunno’ about OP, but quite a few things become “problematic” purely by association with dinguses. Sure, the sigma workaholic crap is problematic by itself, but the new Joker movie (NOT the sequel) _ was_ actually a good movie. It was all the weirdos who turned him in to some idol that made it cringe. (kinda’ like in the movie, even though the character himself enjoyed the recognition)
Personally, I tend to really like flawed characters or tragic back stories and whatnot, and he had both. They could have had a really awesome sequel to show why going down the path of idolatry would be a terrible one, but nooo they had to do a weird “musical” where it turns out he’s not even the joker. Too bad everyone else had to ruin it, even the creators, so I can kinda’ relate to things getting ruined by external forces.
Kinda’ like the US getting fucked by Trump despite every effort to get everyone I know to vote otherwise… Or how people like Johny Somali are giving Americans an even worse reputation as tourists. Some things that are supposed to be good really do simply get ruined by others, because too many people are judgemental guilt-by-association assholes.
Like did you evolve your entire personality around the disturbing characters? Or did you watch them a couple times, quote a few lines here and there?
There is a line and if you are worried people don’t like you anymore because of these movies you probably crossed into the former. The movies are not problematic, but unfortunately the way some people get into them is.
To emphasize: This is not automatically your fault because you enjoyed watching a show.
Media is full of things like this and there a few people that take fandom too far. They are characters and we are intended to hate the characters. Should we feel empathy as we watch their journey? Yes but empathy shouldn’t forgive the crimes they commit. We can feel a connection to their pain but take the lesson and instead of idolize, try to do better.
The workaholic sigma grindset BS is totally problematic, and definitely hints at the wrong kind of Joker idolization, though personally, I like a good warning of bad choices type character. The Joker could’ve been that if the sequel didn’t crap all over the very notion.
It’s also why I (used to) like Rick from Rick and Morty. He’s a terrible, miserable person, despite being capable of almost literally anything. He’s a great warning that happiness doesn’t come from things or power, but personal choices and outlook.
When people online are this vague and hand-wavy, you know 99% of the time they’re downplaying some really stupid stand they took about that something a date or friend didn’t like one fucking time and they can’t let it go.
Or they don’t have friends at all, and just read all the manosphere self-victimization forums.
Edit: he got lost down the menslib rabbit hole of over analyzing everything until reality itself loses meaning and you begin to think breathing is problematic to someone, somewhere.
While I disagree with your gender-oriented spin on this completely, and I don’t think it’s nearly as common as the picture you paint (never heard anyone roasted for liking Fight Club), it does occasionally happen.
I watched the first few episodes of MLP: FIM at a friend’s house by happenstance, and within about a week of airing I told a few people “Surprisingly, it’s actually a pretty good show.” Then the controversial fans came out and I completely stopped talking about the show to protect myself. Literal years later I found out my mom had been loudly proclaiming to anyone who would listen, including distant family, that I was a “brony”. It soured a few tenuous relationships with people who didn’t know me well enough to know it was an absurd label.
I’ve never heard of Fight club being a red flag. Probably it could be one if you’re overly obsessed with the movie, and express it with a focus on the toxic masculine parts of the movie, but in that case the issue is you being a red flag.
Some people do consider it a red flag, because there are idiots who misinterpret the movie and enough of them that interpret it as pro “toxic masculinity” that it’s scared a few people off. (Kinda like how 2019 Joker is a great film, but enough weirdos think it’s an endorsement of their weird behaviors.)
Like it’s a gay man’s satire of masculinity (and about the homoeroticism inherent to fascistic movements). It’s a joke. Notice how the narrator never wants to fuck Martha - that he spends late nights roaming, looking for other men to engage physically with. The fights are a cruising metaphor.
Fincher makes it even more obvious with the casting. Like yeah Helena Bingham Carter is hot, but we’re all here to gawk at Edward Norton and Brad Pitt.
I’ve only seen academic critique and of course more cerebral criticisms because of how they were reflections of their time, like many movies.
If you had actual people in real life attack you for liking these movies, either you were being weird about them and not listening to someone’s academic takes because you don’t understand them or you met a nut. Otherwise I think it’s bullshit and you just wanna be oppressed for liking [POPULAR THING]
I dunno’ man, cruise these comments. Plenty of people attempting to assume the worst even from those movies. Some people are just toxic judgemental assholes, even here on Lemmy.
How do you interpret and discuss Fight Club and Full Metal Jacket in conversation? I like both of these movies and have never had anyone respond negatively when I’ve discussed them.
When you talk about Fight Club, are you talking about it in a way which might suggest you think fight clubs are a good idea?
I’m trying to figure out who would have a problem with Full Metal Jacket.
If you talk about both of those movies in a way that acknowledges Sergeant Hartman and Tyler Durden are not people we should emulate, I don’t think many people would consider those red flags.
People who think that the those movies are red flags have probably met people who think that we are supposed to look up to those characters. If you make it clear that you are not one of those people, there’s not really a problem.
I think the angst in the original post is because some people really do jump to conclusions before even understanding why anything.
Sure, the comic in the main post is a red flag, but that’s mostly the sigma grindset BS. The Joker is an excellent example of judgemental guilt by association, at least if it were in isolation. What if someone likes putting up a good lesson on what not to do?
Like having a poster of Walter White, because he’s an excellently written and acted character that chose to go down a dark path? You’re not going to get the ‘why’ just by seeing a cool poster.
I think as a guy you should never express interest in anything because it’s going to be problematic tomorrow.
That sounds exactly like what someone who once faced consequences for one particular thing would say.
Why are you so in to problematic things?
He listed the highly inappropriate and unpopular movies that nobody ever heard of Full Metal Jacket and Fight Club.
I think someone spends too much time reading posts on the internet.
edit: i was right, yep, menslib subreddit reader.
Oooh fight club? So edgy. That’s that indie flick with complete unknowns Brad Pitt and Edward Norton.
I dunno’ about OP, but quite a few things become “problematic” purely by association with dinguses. Sure, the sigma workaholic crap is problematic by itself, but the new Joker movie (NOT the sequel) _ was_ actually a good movie. It was all the weirdos who turned him in to some idol that made it cringe. (kinda’ like in the movie, even though the character himself enjoyed the recognition)
Personally, I tend to really like flawed characters or tragic back stories and whatnot, and he had both. They could have had a really awesome sequel to show why going down the path of idolatry would be a terrible one, but nooo they had to do a weird “musical” where it turns out he’s not even the joker. Too bad everyone else had to ruin it, even the creators, so I can kinda’ relate to things getting ruined by external forces.
Kinda’ like the US getting fucked by Trump despite every effort to get everyone I know to vote otherwise… Or how people like Johny Somali are giving Americans an even worse reputation as tourists. Some things that are supposed to be good really do simply get ruined by others, because too many people are judgemental guilt-by-association assholes.
Because other people decided they were problematic after I got into them
Like did you evolve your entire personality around the disturbing characters? Or did you watch them a couple times, quote a few lines here and there?
There is a line and if you are worried people don’t like you anymore because of these movies you probably crossed into the former. The movies are not problematic, but unfortunately the way some people get into them is.
To emphasize: This is not automatically your fault because you enjoyed watching a show.
Media is full of things like this and there a few people that take fandom too far. They are characters and we are intended to hate the characters. Should we feel empathy as we watch their journey? Yes but empathy shouldn’t forgive the crimes they commit. We can feel a connection to their pain but take the lesson and instead of idolize, try to do better.
The workaholic sigma grindset BS is totally problematic, and definitely hints at the wrong kind of Joker idolization, though personally, I like a good warning of bad choices type character. The Joker could’ve been that if the sequel didn’t crap all over the very notion.
It’s also why I (used to) like Rick from Rick and Morty. He’s a terrible, miserable person, despite being capable of almost literally anything. He’s a great warning that happiness doesn’t come from things or power, but personal choices and outlook.
Fuck that. Fuck that entirely.
It’s true. A lot of my favorite movies are considered red flags just because enough dude bro dipshits misinterpret them.
When people online are this vague and hand-wavy, you know 99% of the time they’re downplaying some really stupid stand they took about that something a date or friend didn’t like one fucking time and they can’t let it go.
Or they don’t have friends at all, and just read all the manosphere self-victimization forums.
Edit: he got lost down the menslib rabbit hole of over analyzing everything until reality itself loses meaning and you begin to think breathing is problematic to someone, somewhere.
Or they don’t want to deeply engage with something where everyone is shitting on them? Jeeze, you armchair psychologists are just as bad as Redditors…
They’ve explained in other posts how they properly interpret Fight Club, yet here you are, assuming the worst.
I am not saying I am a victim. I am just expressing frustration with something. Shit like this is why those places got popular.
While I disagree with your gender-oriented spin on this completely, and I don’t think it’s nearly as common as the picture you paint (never heard anyone roasted for liking Fight Club), it does occasionally happen.
I watched the first few episodes of MLP: FIM at a friend’s house by happenstance, and within about a week of airing I told a few people “Surprisingly, it’s actually a pretty good show.” Then the controversial fans came out and I completely stopped talking about the show to protect myself. Literal years later I found out my mom had been loudly proclaiming to anyone who would listen, including distant family, that I was a “brony”. It soured a few tenuous relationships with people who didn’t know me well enough to know it was an absurd label.
Such as? Let’s see what you got
Fight Club and Full Metal Jacket to name two.
I’ve never heard of Fight club being a red flag. Probably it could be one if you’re overly obsessed with the movie, and express it with a focus on the toxic masculine parts of the movie, but in that case the issue is you being a red flag.
Some people do consider it a red flag, because there are idiots who misinterpret the movie and enough of them that interpret it as pro “toxic masculinity” that it’s scared a few people off. (Kinda like how 2019 Joker is a great film, but enough weirdos think it’s an endorsement of their weird behaviors.)
Like it’s a gay man’s satire of masculinity (and about the homoeroticism inherent to fascistic movements). It’s a joke. Notice how the narrator never wants to fuck Martha - that he spends late nights roaming, looking for other men to engage physically with. The fights are a cruising metaphor.
Fincher makes it even more obvious with the casting. Like yeah Helena Bingham Carter is hot, but we’re all here to gawk at Edward Norton and Brad Pitt.
Those are insanely popular movies.
I’ve only seen academic critique and of course more cerebral criticisms because of how they were reflections of their time, like many movies.
If you had actual people in real life attack you for liking these movies, either you were being weird about them and not listening to someone’s academic takes because you don’t understand them or you met a nut. Otherwise I think it’s bullshit and you just wanna be oppressed for liking [POPULAR THING]
I dunno’ man, cruise these comments. Plenty of people attempting to assume the worst even from those movies. Some people are just toxic judgemental assholes, even here on Lemmy.
Agree
I just don’t tell people I like them.
what the… then, how could you possibly be attacked for liking them?
Are you just creating things in your mind to feel bad about???
Because hear people talk about them.
How do you interpret and discuss Fight Club and Full Metal Jacket in conversation? I like both of these movies and have never had anyone respond negatively when I’ve discussed them.
When you talk about Fight Club, are you talking about it in a way which might suggest you think fight clubs are a good idea?
I’m trying to figure out who would have a problem with Full Metal Jacket.
The same kind of person that would fuck somebody in the ass and not have the goddamn decency to give him a reach-around!
It’s how other n people talk about it. They act like Hartman and Tyler were awesome bad asses and not the unhinged assholes they were.
If you talk about both of those movies in a way that acknowledges Sergeant Hartman and Tyler Durden are not people we should emulate, I don’t think many people would consider those red flags.
People who think that the those movies are red flags have probably met people who think that we are supposed to look up to those characters. If you make it clear that you are not one of those people, there’s not really a problem.
I think the angst in the original post is because some people really do jump to conclusions before even understanding why anything.
Sure, the comic in the main post is a red flag, but that’s mostly the sigma grindset BS. The Joker is an excellent example of judgemental guilt by association, at least if it were in isolation. What if someone likes putting up a good lesson on what not to do?
Like having a poster of Walter White, because he’s an excellently written and acted character that chose to go down a dark path? You’re not going to get the ‘why’ just by seeing a cool poster.